Incredible Voyage

[cyrano]

I'd forgotten how twigged I was by the UberMensch* undertones in The Incredibles.
The rest of the film is still a lot of fun, and it gave my PCGF work; it's just the one thing.

*Society is a burden to the UberMench, forcing him to sacrifice his excellence and take on the mediocrity of the herd. If only the world would let him be himself, existing outside the rules of society, everyone would benefit.

EDIT: A discussion with a friend indicates that I need to expound on my topic. It is not that I think the characters are UberMenschen who need to be dragged down to the level of everybody else. It's that I think the director feels that if only society would recognize the greatness of certain people who were born great then they could feel free to be full of greatness. Or something. I mean, at the end of the movie you have the track competition where our newly heroic hero tells his son how to be less exceptional than he really is, in order to fit in. Which, as far as I can tell, was directly against the point the director was trying to make. Jesus fuck, it's one in the morning and I'm so far behind schedule and so stupid tired that you should quit listening.
But I still think it'd be funny if Google were invited to take part in College Bowl.

Comments

[eyelessgame.livejournal.com]

Yah, it would have gone right past me if I hadn't heard Brad Bird was a R*ndroid. But then again, it's a superhero story. I hear tell superheroes have some relationship to 'ubermenschen', if I can just think what the relationship might be.

[tavella.livejournal.com]

Even before I knew Bird was a Randroid, the Dash subplot seemed creepy to me. First we see him using his powers to abuse his teacher, and the movie essentially celebrates him for it -- the teacher is presented as ridiculous, and his father praises Dash. Then at the end, he's not "being himself" -- he's lying. He's not racing, not running as fast as he can run, he's just using enough of his power to take the victory from people who are actually working for it. It's the equivalent of feeling proud because adult-you just beat a bunch of six year olds, and ran slow enough to just stay ahead of them.

[senatorhatty.livejournal.com]

Yes but...

Where do you draw the line when determining what is fair? If there are two dudes on a track team and one of them is naturally faster than the other (so he works less hard in practice), do you say that the naturally faster guy is taking victory away from the other dude? Do you say that about a kid who has the highest GPA in his class without studying, when the second-place kid had to study for hours a night to get her 3.99 GPA?

By the way, apparently my old High School DID think that natural talent, and/or focus was somehow detracting from the achievement of the less-intelligent and/or focused. When my little brother was in school, they decided to stop recognizing students on the basis of highest GPA. The Valedictorian, Salutatorian, &c. had to APPLY for the, uh, position. It really pissed my family off, even though I think my little bro ended up Salutatorian anyway.

That said, it's kind of stupid for Dash to have been on the track team at all except insofar as it might have helped the little freak make some friends.

[roseneko.livejournal.com]

Frankly, I think you're being a tad oversensitive. The fact is, we live in a culture that does increasingly hold up mediocrity as something to be glorified while suppressing those who have extraordinary gifts and try to make use of them - it's a fundamental aspect of human nature (fear of difference) that's sadly brought to the forefront in Western culture. Does that mean that gifted people should be allowed to live outside all societal bounds? Absolutely not. But there's a balance to be struck, and right now we're a bit uncomfortably far on the "conformity" side.

Probably the biggest reason I don't see The Incredibles as being Rand-esque is simply that the main characters are so fundamentally good, to the point of near-ridiculousness. If it were a treatise on the theory of the UberMensch, Bob and his family wouldn't have had any sort of conscience, let alone be as ridiculously lawful-good as they are. The story's supposed to be an inspiration and invitation to use your individual talents to their fullest, not to consider yourself above society if you happen to be possessed of particularly strong ones.

Also, you really need to play BioShock.

[cyranocyrano.livejournal.com]

I have heard this word, BioShock.

Also, you should be extraordinary. As should I.

[tavella.livejournal.com]

People keep claiming this, and I see a remarkable lack of actual real world backing for it. If anything, our society has gotten *more* uneven in its rewards.

[senatorhatty.livejournal.com]

Well, I don't know about people with super powers, but it's pretty clear that a goodly number of folks liked former President Bush BECAUSE of his disdain for intellectualism, and these people similarly didn't like Gore/Kerry/Obama because they embodied this.

I do think society is uneven in its rewards, but I am not sure just how much actual talent has to do with it, and how much of it is a combination of talent, societal interest in the subject (for example, sports heroes), and luck.

[pielology.livejournal.com]

Simplistic treatments of the relationship between the individual and society have been generally pissing me off lately. Entertainment, serious political philosophy, whatever - lately whenever I see someone failing to respect/honor/subtleify both sides of that rhetorical tension I want to punch them in the mouth.

I don't understand why.

[senatorhatty.livejournal.com]

Because punching people in the face is just awesome.